Let’s talk about that weird emotional hangover you get after confronting your husband’s bad behavior. You know, the one where he hurts you, but somehow you end up feeling sorry for him? Yep. That old chestnut. In this episode, I get real about the trap so many of us Christian women fall into, the compassion boomerang that keeps us stuck in abusive marriages.

I’ve lived this. I breathed this for 25 years. I know exactly what it feels like to see the abuse for what it is, feel a spark of righteous anger… only to have it snuffed out by a fake tear, a Bible verse, or a bouquet of “I didn’t mean it that way” flowers. Before you know it, you’re back to feeling like the monster for having feelings in the first place.

So I’m calling it out. We’re unpacking why this happens, how it messes with your brain, and what you can do to flip the script and start feeling sorry for the person who truly deserves your compassion: you.

What I Want You to Walk Away With:

• You’re not crazy. You’re chemically trauma bonded. And yes, that’s a thing.
• Your compassion is beautiful, but when it’s misdirected at your abuser, it becomes a prison.
• The church has taught us to tolerate abuse in the name of Jesus—and honestly, Jesus would’ve flipped a table over that.
• Grief isn’t the enemy. Denial is. Grief is the beginning of healing.
• You can feel sorry for yourself. You should. That’s what healing starts with.
• You don’t need to be brave enough for the whole mountain—just the next step.
• You are the one who’s going to rescue you. (No prince required.)

Read the full show notes and/or ask Natalie a question here

Related Resources:

Liked this episode? Then you’ll like two of my other Flying Free Podcast episodes, “How Can You Tell if Your Abusive Partner Has Changed?” and “Why You Can’t Stop Thinking About Your Abuser - and When That Changes.”

Have you ever sat in a women’s Bible study, nodding politely while someone says “your husband is your spiritual covering,” and inside you’re thinking, I think I’m dying a little bit every time I say “yes, dear”?

In this episode, I get real about complementarianism, the nice-sounding theology that quietly hijacked our self-worth, autonomy, and sanity. I share how I was the poster child for it once (hello, Created to Be His Help Meet), and how that life script nearly destroyed my soul.

I’m unpacking the research, the psychology, the theology, and yes, the “are you kidding me right now?” stories from real women who’ve lived this. It's systemic. And it's deeply damaging.

What You’ll Learn:

• How complementarianism teaches learned helplessness (like, literal textbook psychology)
• That a shocking number of women from these teachings suffer from anxiety, decision fatigue, and depression but think it’s a faith issue, not a mental health one
• Why your pastor’s advice to “submit harder” is about as helpful as telling someone with a broken leg to “walk it off with a godly attitude”
• That yes, the research confirms it: biblical womanhood theology messes with your brain
• How to tell the difference between “conviction” and religious trauma

Read the full show notes and/or ask Natalie a question here

Related Resources:

• Head to our website to find ALL the resources I packed into today’s episode.
• Check out some related Flying Free resources, including an article I wrote called “How Complementarianism Causes Abuse in Churches and Homes” and an episode called “Do Gender Roles Contribute to Emotional Abuse in the Home and Church?”

In this episode, I’m diving into a question I get all the time: Is legal separation the better option for Christian women in emotionally and spiritually abusive marriages? Or is divorce actually the path to healing and wholeness?

(Please note: this episode is for Christian women considering a more permanent end to their relationship. If that's not you, give this one a pass for today!)

I know how hard it is to navigate these decisions, especially when your faith, your safety, and your identity are all tangled together. I’ve lived it. I’ve wrestled with it. And I’ve coached hundreds of women through it.

So I’m walking you through the differences between legal separation and divorce from a biblical, emotional, financial, and psychological perspective without shame, fear tactics, or pressure. Just clarity, truth, and love.

What You’ll Learn:

• What legal separation really involves (hint: it’s not just sleeping in separate rooms)
• The truth behind “God hates divorce” and what Scripture actually says
• How legal separation can keep you stuck emotionally and financially
• Why divorce might be the healthiest choice for you and your children
• What your church may be getting wrong—and how to respond with courage and grace
• My own story of choosing divorce and what changed in my life after

Read the full show notes and/or ask Natalie a question here

Related Resources:

• Get a free, practical guide to legal separation and divorce that will help you decide what is best for you.
• Some more Flying Free Podcast episodes on divorce and separation: “How Do I Know if Divorce Is the Right Choice for Me?” “Will God Punish Me if I Get a Divorce?” “During Separation, How Do I Deal With an Overwhelming Workload and No Support?”

In this episode, Natalie shares the raw, unfiltered voices of Christian women who took a powerful step toward reclaiming their lives. What begins with deep confusion, spiritual exhaustion, and the belief that “I’m the problem” transforms into clarity, courage, and freedom. This episode is a love letter to every woman who feels stuck in a toxic relationship yet longs for something more.

Through the annual Flying Free satisfaction survey, listeners hear dozens of honest, heart-wrenching, and ultimately hopeful testimonies of what healing looks like when women dare to believe they deserve better.

Key Takeaways:

• You are not the problem. Many women enter Flying Free believing they’re broken. The truth? They’re trapped in harmful belief systems—not failures.
• Healing is possible. Even women who felt suicidal or hopeless now describe themselves as joyful, empowered, and free.
• You don’t have to do it alone. Community and coaching are a lifeline. The kaleidoscope of women in Flying Free offers safety, connection, and understanding.
• Transformation isn’t a miracle—it’s a process. One decision at a time, one new belief at a time, one boundary at a time. And it works.

Read the full show notes and/or ask Natalie a question here

Related Resources:

• Want to learn more about a tool we use inside the program all the time that literally changes lives? Check out Episode 160 of the Flying Free Podcast.

What happens when the man everyone admires is the one silently destroying your soul behind closed doors?

In this gripping episode, I sit down with Lisa: a strong, truth-telling woman who walked through 40 years of emotional and spiritual abuse in her marriage. From the trauma of date rape on her first date, to the covert spiritual manipulation in a seemingly “perfect” Christian home, Lisa vulnerably shares how she survived, how she healed, and how she’s now helping other women rise.

This episode is not just a story. It’s a reclamation.

Key Takeaways:

• “You’re not crazy—he just told you that you were.” Lisa unpacks the slow unraveling of decades of covert abuse masked as devotion.
• How Christian culture kept her trapped in a narrative of self-blame, silence, and “submission.”
• The pivotal role of trauma-informed therapy, especially EMDR, in unlocking the truth and breaking the trauma bond.
• Lisa’s experience with betrayal by Christian counselors and the devastating weaponization of Scripture.
• Why she now calls it an escape—not a divorce.
• The healing power of boundaries, honest storytelling, and godly anger.
• What real love looks like after abuse—and yes, it can come at 66.

Read the full show notes and/or ask Natalie a question here

Related Resources:

• Want to listen to some more survivor stories? Check out Erin’s story and Marie’s story.

In this episode of The Flying Free Podcast, we’re talking about a book that forever changed my understanding of evil—M. Scott Peck's People of the Lie.

This isn't about cartoon villains or obvious monsters. I'm talking about the kind of evil that sits in church pews, leads Bible studies, and goes home to emotionally destroy their families while maintaining a pristine public image.

Have you ever felt crazy for questioning someone's "godly" behavior when it leaves you feeling diminished and confused? You're not alone, and you're not imagining things. In this episode, I break down the subtle patterns of evil that hide behind masks of righteousness, especially in Christian contexts.

In this powerful episode, you'll discover:

• Why the most dangerous form of evil isn't loud or obvious, but subtle, polite, and often dressed in religious language and "concern" for your spiritual wellbeing

• How to recognize scapegoating—the psychological process where someone transfers their shame onto you, making you carry the emotional burden for the entire relationship

• The chilling reality of how evil people use virtue and spiritual leadership as masks to hide their true nature, and why religious communities often protect the abuser rather than the abused

• Practical ways to trust your own perceptions again after years of having your reality denied and twisted

If you've ever been told you're overreacting, too sensitive, or not spiritual enough when trying to address harmful behavior, this episode will validate your experience and give you the language to understand what you've been through.

The journey toward freedom begins with recognizing the lies for what they are. Join me as we unpack this transformative book and discover how naming evil is the first step toward reclaiming your life and your truth.

Read the show notes and/or ask Natalie a question here

Related Resources:

• Grab your copy of M. Scott Peck's People of the Lie
• Want to check out some other books I recommend? I have a whole laundry list.

Strap in, ladies. This episode is basically law school meets your best girlfriend telling you how to survive divorce court with a toxic ex who thinks the law is optional and reality is negotiable. I’m joined by Arizona attorney Wendy Hernandez (aka courtroom gladiator and truth-spewer), who unpacks what you really need to know when facing custody battles, financial warfare, and the endless parade of legal shenanigans from an abusive ex.

This episode was originally a private workshop inside the Flying Free Kaleidoscope community, and now it's yours, too. You're welcome. (And also, if you want more, jump in with us!)

Key Takeaways:

• How to get out when you're financially trapped
• What temporary orders are and how they can help you immediately
• Why documentation beats opinions in court, and how to gather it smartly
• Secrets to dealing with exes who refuse to work or disclose income
• How to present strong evidence without being overwhelmed
• Legal options for supervised visitation and protecting your children
• Modifying custody when major life changes occur
• Protecting kids from subtle forms of abuse within court limitations
• How to handle mediators and avoid coerced agreements
• Sanctioning your ex for using the legal system abusively
• The emotional encouragement you need when you feel too overwhelmed to fight back

Read the show notes and/or ask Natalie a question here

Related Resources:

• Wendy’s YouTube channel: Command the Courtroom
• Her “Best Interests of the Child” checklist
• The “Is Love Resilience” worksheet (traits that resilient women develop to rebuild their lives)
• The “Know Your Rights – Protect. Prepare. Empower. Escape” worksheet
• Our Day’s co-parenting calendar app
• Aimee Says, an AI app to help you craft response, document abuse, prepare for court, and more
• Flying Free Podcast Episode 220 with Wendy: Dealing with Fear During Divorce

Having tried over 1,000 cases during her twenty-seven years as a litigator, Wendy is a courtroom warrior who has tackled every type of family law matter — from divorce to child custody and everything in between. Sharing secrets learned from the country’s top law professors at the University of Notre Dame Law School and during her battles on the family law front lines, Wendy is passionate about helping not only her clients, but also those representing themselves, to feel competent, confident and comfortable in the courtroom.

So many of you come to me and say things like, "Natalie, I was such a doormat. I just stood there and let it all happen."

Listen up, beautiful butterfly: You didn’t “just stand there.” You were resisting the entire time, and no one told you that’s what it was. Until now.

In this episode, I shine a flashlight on the small but powerful acts of resistance Christian women pull off daily in emotionally and spiritually abusive marriages. We’re talking journal-hiding, secret-crying, sanity-preserving, Jesus-whispering defiance that deserves a standing ovation—but probably got met with church lady side-eye instead.

Here’s what you’ll learn:

• What resistance really looks like
• Why keeping your mouth shut can be a power move
• How even the tiniest choice—like skipping his coffee—can be the first domino to freedom
• Why the culture you were raised in trained you to erase your own bravery—and how we’re done with that now

Read the show notes and/or ask Natalie a question here

Related Resources:

• This podcast script is inspired by Allan Wade’s article, “Small Acts of Living: Everyday Resistance to Violence and Other Forms of Oppression.”
• Some related Flying Free Podcast episodes you may enjoy: “Should a Christian Wife Submit to an Abusive Husband?” and “An Emotional Recovery Tool That Changes Everything.”