With this year's Infinite Dial report from Edison Research now in the wild, and co-presented at Podcast Movement Evolutions in Chicago, it's the perfect time to have one of the presenters, James Cridland, on the show to dive into the findings.

From online audio listening preferences to the opportunities for creators and brands, James walks us through some of the nuances of the report.

James also dives into the Podnews Report Card 2025, where podcasters and creators get to share their feedback directly with the teams behind podcast apps and platforms like Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube and more.

Join regular co-host Danny Brown and James in this very enlightening episode!

Guest co-host this episode: James Cridland

James Cridland is Editor of Podnews, the daily podcast newsletter. He is a radio futurologist - a writer, consultant and public speaker on radio’s future. James has worked in audio since 1989 as an award-winning copywriter, radio presenter, and internet strategist. One of the organisers of Next Radio, the UK radio ideas conference, James has worked with the world’s largest radio conference, Radiodays Europe, since its inception. He’s also part of the programming team for Radiodays Asia and Podcast Day 24.

James's Website

@JamesCridland on X

Links to interesting things from this episode

• The Infinite Dial 2025 - Edison Research
• Podcasting 2.0 with Dave Jones and Adam Curry
• Pocket Casts - listen to podcasts with the best free podcasting app. Built by listeners, for listeners.
• iHeartMedia purchased podcast plays to game their download numbers and the IAB says it's ok!? John Spurlock talks OP3.dev and how it could help filter this bad practice.
• Adam Curry - curryirc.com (@adamcurry) / X
• James Cridland | James Cridland - radio futurologist
• The Podnews Report Card 2025 Results

In & Around Podcasting is a podcast industry podcast brought to you by Mark Asquith and Danny Brown.

If you enjoy the show, we'd love for you to leave us a rating or review on your favourite podcast app! You can also drop us a tip at https://www.inandaroundpodcasting.com/support, too!

If you're an independent creator who would like to co-host with us, please let us know via Twitter and we'll get you booked!

Please tell your friends that the show is available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and YouTube, plus wherever else they may listen to their podcasts.

If you'd like your podcast trailer featuring in our "Wave File" segment, submit it via this quick contact form, please.

The podcast is also available at

As podcasting continues to see a mix of large investments and ad spend, it also continues to see layoffs across the industry. Many point to some of these large investments as being a cause, with money being spent on large networks and celebrity podcasts.

Is this a sign that the industry needs to take a different approach, with perhaps more indie creator-led networks, or is it an unfortunate realism of an industry growing beyond its small beginnings?

Join regular co-host Danny Brown and guest co-host Frank Racioppi as they discuss this interesting topic.

Guest co-host this episode: Frank Racioppi

After 38 years as a speechwriter and editor for a Fortune 50 company, Frank retired and indulged his love of podcasting, starting and managing a successful podcast review online publication -- Ear Worthy. He started it in 2017 and has enjoyed connecting with indie podcasters and anyone who supports podcasting. Frank and his brother Paul had a podcast four years ago called False Facts, but it was difficult to keep a regular recording schedule. He's loved writing his entire life and wrote for print magazines in the 80s from New Jersey Monthly, The Pet Dealer, American Health, The Sewing Circle, etc. He's also published five novels and four non-fiction books in the last four years. The novels range from a romance about two people bonding over the love of reading called For The Love Of Books to Least Best Employee, a novel about surviving as middle management in Corporate America. His most popular nonfiction book was called The COVID Hotel.

Frank's Website

@podcastreports on X

@earworthy141 on Instagram

Links to interesting things from this episode

• Broadway Podcast Network - The Art of Kindness with Robert Peterpaul
• Every Single Sci-Fi Film Ever | Science Fiction Movie Podcast
• Gastropod - Food with a Side of Science & History
• Filmspotting Movie Podcast
• Top US Podcast Publishers & Networks - Podtrac
• Mercury hits 2 million delivered ads
• Bobbi Althoff joins Studio71's podcast network with The Really Good Podcast
• How celebrity podcasts are influencing a new era of tabloid media
• Celebrity Podcasts Roundtable: Challenges and Opportunities | Podcast Movement
• These Brands SHOULD Sponsor These Independent Podcasts
• The Marketing Swarm Around Indie Podcasters
• Independent Podcasting Needs More Networks Like Mercury

In & Around Podcasting is a podcast industry podcast brought to you by Mark Asquith and Danny Brown.

If you enjoy the show, we'd love for you to leave us a rating or review on your favourite podcast app! You can also drop us a tip at

The Podcasting 2.0 initiative has been around since 2020, and is a way for the traditional RSS feed to be more interactive both for podcasters and listeners. This means offering features like transcripts, chapters, credits for talent on podcasters, funding your favourite shows, and more.

It's also meant to keep the RSS system open and "protect" it from the walled garden approach of Spotify, YouTube, and - to a lesser degree - Apple Podcasts.

Bit despite being the brainchild of the podcast OG Adam Curry, and lots of vocal support from certain parts of the industry, it seems that Podcasting 2.0 is still struggling to gain a real foothold. So why hasn't Podcasting 2.0 taken off, and has the boat sailed for this initiative?

Join regular hosts Mark and Danny, with guest co-host Claire Waite Brown, as they dive into this much-vaunted but sometimes equally-maligned topic.

This week's guest co-host: Claire Waite Brown

Indie podcaster - Creativity Found, 2020 to present; Podcasting 2.0 in Practice Jan 2025 to present Creativity Found podcast inspired me to build a directory of creative activities for adults, all taught by independent small business owners who are members of the Creativity Found Collective. Became interested in 2.0 through listening to podcasts about podcasting and meeting proponents at podcast live events. Friends with many indie podcasters who feel they 'should' know what 2.0 is, but not sure where to start, or if they should bother! Teach a dance fitness class, edit books, member of a parents' street dance crew!!

Claire's Facebook group

Claire's Facebook page

@podcasting2.0inpractice on Instagram

Claire on YouTube

Claire's Website

Links to interesting things from this episode

• MIC's (virtual/in-person) Podcast Club for global podcasters
• Is Podcasting 2.0 Pointless? - In & Around Podcasting
• The Podfather launches a new, open podcast directory
• Best Host for Podcasting 2.0 - Find Out How! | Captivate
• Podcast Index Podcasting 2.0 Statistics, visualized
• Podcasting 2.0 V4V Stats Uptake
• Podcasting 2.0 Namespace Adoption
• Apps | Podcastindex.org
• Podcasting 2.0 - Making podcasts better for everyone!

In & Around Podcasting is a podcast industry podcast brought to you by Mark Asquith and Danny Brown.

If you enjoy the show, we'd love for you to leave us a rating or review on your favourite podcast app! You can also drop us a tip at https://www.inandaroundpodcasting.com/support, too!

If you're an independent creator who would like to co-host with us, please let us know via Twitter and we'll get you booked!

Please tell your friends that the show is available on Spotify,

The episode provides an insightful recap of the recent PodFest event, a significant gathering in the podcasting industry, characterized by its inclusive atmosphere and focus on community building. Mr. Mark and co-host Chris delve into the origins of PodFest, tracing its inception back to grassroots meetups aimed at supporting podcasters in their journey. Through their dialogue, they reveal how PodFest has grown organically, driven by the collective needs of its attendees, resulting in a unique event that is both educational and supportive. Chris shares anecdotes from the event, illustrating the relationships that have formed over the years and the nurturing environment that PodFest fosters.

The discussion transitions to the evolving landscape of podcasting, with both hosts reflecting on the challenges and opportunities faced by indie creators. They emphasize the significance of networking and collaboration in the industry, noting how PodFest serves as a hub for podcasters of all levels to connect and share experiences. The hosts highlight specific sessions and interactions from PodFest, showcasing the diverse range of content and learning opportunities available to attendees. They convey a sense of optimism about the future of podcasting, underlining the role of events like PodFest in shaping the industry and supporting the next generation of creators.

In concluding remarks, Mark and Chris reiterate their commitment to fostering a spirit of inclusivity and support within the podcasting community. They invite listeners to engage with PodFest and consider attending future events, emphasizing the value of being part of a community that celebrates creativity and collaboration in podcasting. The episode serves as a compelling testament to the power of community in the podcasting realm, encouraging listeners to take part in this vibrant ecosystem.

In & Around Podcasting is a podcast industry podcast brought to you by Mark Asquith and Danny Brown.

If you enjoy the show, we'd love for you to leave us a rating or review on your favourite podcast app! You can also drop us a tip at https://www.inandaroundpodcasting.com/support, too!

If you're an independent creator who would like to co-host with us, please let us know via Twitter and we'll get you booked!

Please tell your friends that the show is available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and YouTube, plus wherever else they may listen to their podcasts.

If you'd like your podcast trailer featuring in our "Wave File" segment, submit it via this quick contact form, please.

The podcast is also available at In & Around Podcasting.

2024 saw Spotify make a big push for video on their platform, while it also seemed anywhere you turned online was someone telling podcasters they need to do video to stay relevant.

So, is 2025 the year we all need to get on board with video podcasting, or does audio-first podcasting still have merits? Join your regular hosts Mark Asquith and Danny Brown, as well as guest co-host John McDermott, as they look to answer the question on everyone's lips: what does the push for video mean for podcasting and podcasters?

Our guest co-host this week: John McDermott

Co-Founder of Caloroga Shark Media, a podcast company focused on short-form pods. Previously EVP programming for Cadence 13. Before that 10 years at SiriusXM (VP Comedy & Entertainment). Before THAT a decade at WOR New York doing talk radio I am the host of the podcasts 5 Good News Stories and Daily Comedy News. Substack where I pontificate is John McDermott's Media Thoughts (mcdpod.substack.com) and people are encouraged to be my LinkedIn friend.

John's Website

@mcdradio on X

Links to interesting things from this episode

• Dave & Dave Unchained Van Halen podcast Podcast – Apple Podcasts
• Podcast Predictions, Trends & Tips for 2025
• Will Video Kill the Audio Star in 2025?
• Podcasting's unique selling proposition is not video | James Cridland - radio futurologist

In & Around Podcasting is a podcast industry podcast brought to you by Mark Asquith and Danny Brown.

If you enjoy the show, we'd love for you to leave us a rating or review on your favourite podcast app! You can also drop us a tip at https://www.inandaroundpodcasting.com/support, too!

If you're an independent creator who would like to co-host with us, please let us know via Twitter and we'll get you booked!

Please tell your friends that the show is available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and YouTube, plus wherever else they may listen to their podcasts.

If you'd like your podcast trailer featuring in our "Wave File" segment, submit it via this quick contact form, please.

The podcast is also available at In & Around Podcasting.

Join Mark and Danny in this bonus episode, as they reflect on the past year of In & Around Podcasting, share some important advice about frequency of publishing, and what's coming up in 2025.

Are you an indie podcaster looking to guest on the show next year? Sign up here!

Links to interesting things from this episode

• Pod Chat, with Danny Brown
• The Podcast Accelerator by Mark Asquith
• Taking a break for a month? : r/podcasting
• Podcast Discovery Stats: How Folks Find Pods, & Why They Listen

In & Around Podcasting is a podcast industry podcast brought to you by Mark Asquith and Danny Brown.

If you enjoy the show, we'd love for you to leave us a rating or review on your favourite podcast app! You can also drop us a tip at https://www.inandaroundpodcasting.com/support, too!

If you're an independent creator who would like to co-host with us, please let us know via Twitter and we'll get you booked!

Please tell your friends that the show is available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and YouTube, plus wherever else they may listen to their podcasts.

If you'd like your podcast trailer featuring in our "Wave File" segment, submit it via this quick contact form, please.

The podcast is also available at In & Around Podcasting.

There are many valuations of the podcast industry, depending on what report you read.

• Polaris valued the global worth at $13.7B in 2021, expected to grow an average of 31.5% CAGR (compound annual growth rate) through to 2030 (seems supremely high)
• Fortune Business Insights show is as $2.2B in 2022, projected to grow to $17.59B in 2030, a CAGR of 29.8%

Meanwhile, the IAB shares US ad revenue as $1.8B in 2022, rising to $1.9 in 2023 (which seems closer to Fortune Business Insights and their global ranking). So you can see why there's confusion.

Join Mark and Danny, and this week's guest co-host Rob Greenlee, as they break this all down in the usual In & Around Podcasting way.

Our guest co-host this week: Rob Greenlee

Rob Greenlee, a 2017 Podcast Hall of Fame inductee and podcasting pioneer, has spent over 24 years shaping the online media industry. As founder of Spoken Life Media - Adore Podcast Network and Creator Community, and Multi-Camera Video Production. He is also host of Podcast Tips with Rob Greenlee and Trust Factor Shows, he empowers creators with practical insights and innovative strategies. Rob’s background includes leadership roles at Microsoft, PodcastOne, Spreaker, and Libsyn, where he drove content development, distribution, and partnerships. He also co-hosts the 12-year running New Media Show with Todd Cochrane, providing weekly industry updates. As Chairperson of the Podcast Hall of Fame, Rob continues to champion the podcasting community worldwide through speaking and mentorship.

Rob's Website

Rob on YouTube

Rob's Facebook page

@robwgreenlee on Instagram

@robgreenlee on X

Links to interesting things from this episode

• Arielle Nissenblatt
• Podcast Hall of Fame
• PODFEST EXPO | Where Your Voice Matters
• Podcast Industry Statistics 2024 – Global Market Size and Growth | Comprehensive podcast industry statistics for 2024. Collaborative wiki covers global market size, growth trends, platform market share, and advertising revenue estimates.
• Podcasting Market Size, Share, Revenue | Fortune Business Insights
• Polaris Podcasting Market Size Global Report, 2022 - 2030
• IAB US Podcast Advertising Revenue Study FY2023 May 2024.pdf
• Justin Jackson on X: "I keep seeing two numbers for the podcast industry: "Podcasting is a $2 billion a year industry." "The podcast industry is worth $20 billion." Can anyone tell me where these numbers come from and how they're calculated? (They're often quoted but never cited)" / X

In & Around Podcasting is a podcast industry podcast brought to you by Mark Asquith and Danny Brown.

If you enjoy the show, we'd love for you to leave us a rating or review on your favourite podcast app! You can also drop us a tip at https://www.inandaroundpodcasting.com/support, too!

If you're an independent creator who would like to co-host with us, please let us know via

As Artificial Intelligence continues to be ever more present in podcasting, discussions and conversations have appeared online at an equal rate on whether this is a good or bad thing for the podcasting industry.

Does it make life easier when it comes to creating content, or does it run the risk of making podcasting redundant through an increased lack of originality?

Join Mark, Danny, and guest co-host Liam Heffernan as they dissect the article and review each viewpoint.

Our guest co-host this week: Liam Heffernan

@thisistheheff on X

Links to interesting things from this episode

• Independent Podcast Awards
• Em @Verbal Diorama: A Film History Podcast (@VerbalDiorama) / X
• Verbal Diorama
• Scarlett Johansson’s OpenAI clash is just the start of legal wrangles over artificial intelligence | Artificial intelligence (AI) | The Guardian
• Apollo Pods | Best Podcast App for Fiction Lovers
• How Can Podcast Discoverability Be Improved: The Ultimate Podcast Puzzle - Ear Worthy
• Does AI Need Regulation in Podcasting? - In & Around Podcasting

In & Around Podcasting is a podcast industry podcast brought to you by Mark Asquith and Danny Brown.

If you enjoy the show, we'd love for you to leave us a rating or review on your favourite podcast app! You can also drop us a tip at https://www.inandaroundpodcasting.com/support, too!

If you're an independent creator who would like to co-host with us, please let us know via Twitter and we'll get you booked!

Please tell your friends that the show is available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and YouTube, plus wherever else they may listen to their podcasts.

If you'd like your podcast trailer featuring in our "Wave File" segment, submit it via this quick contact form, please.

The podcast is also available at In & Around Podcasting.