In a MarTech landscape saturated with tools and AI-powered everything, Phil Gamache offers a timely reminder: the tech only matters if the humans using it are empowered. He and Sara dive into the rise of “counterculture” marketing—where brands win by spotlighting the people behind the process, not just the tools that power them.

Phil:
" It's not a differentiating factor to say that you're AI-powered. It's the default now. You should be, and it shouldn't really be part of your messaging.”

Links & Resources:
Connect with Sara: linkedin.com/in/sara-faatz-b67213
Connect with Phil: linkedin.com/in/gamacp
Explore The Humans of MarTech: humansofmartech.com
Learn more about Progress: progress.com

Timestamps:
00:30 –  Spotlighting Martech Tools
03:15 – The Human Element in Martech
04:55 – Innovative Uses of AI in Martech
07:05 – AI Advice for Beginners
09:05 – Industry Leaders for Inspiration

Hazem El Zayat, Chief Experience Officer for the MENA region at Ogilvy, joins Sara to challenge the status quo of how AI is used in marketing today. From content generators to so-called chatbots, Hazem argues we’ve only scratched the surface of what AI can and should be doing. Hazem discusses why strategy must always come before tech selection, how brands can co-design relationships with customers, and why predictive modeling and next-best-action frameworks are the future of AI-powered experience.

Hazem:
"Is writing emails what AI was meant for? Not really. Let’s talk about predictive modeling, natural language processing, and elevating healthcare, travel, and more."

Links & Resources:
Connect with Sara: linkedin.com/in/sara-faatz-b67213
Connect with Hazem: linkedin.com/in/hazem-el-zayat-ccxp-2871593
Learn more about Progress: progress.com

Timestamps:
00:20 – The overwhelming MarTech landscape: too many tools, not enough strategy
01:40 – AI misuse: What it’s doing vs. what it should be doing
04:30 – Why chatbots often disappoint
05:00 – True CX: Relationship co-design, not customer “management”
07:45 – CX done right: Banks, airlines, and even a luxury retailer
08:35 – MarTech hot take: CX is everyone’s job
10:05 – Go-to sources for MarTech inspiration

Juan Mendoza, CEO of The Martech Weekly, joins the show to unpack a major shift in customer experience: volitional personalization. As consumers increasingly rely on AI agents like ChatGPT to guide purchase decisions, marketers are losing control over the touchpoints that once defined the buyer journey. Juan and Sara dive into how this pull-based model flips the script on traditional campaign strategies and forces brands to rethink their approach to data, content, and visibility.

Juan:
“Consumers actually using AI agents to do their bidding for them is an entirely new channel that we have no idea how to grapple with yet.”

Links & Resources:
Connect with Sara: linkedin.com/in/sara-faatz-b67213
Connect with Juan: linkedin.com/in/juan-mendoza-2b3a63a4
Read The Martech Weekly: themartechweekly.com
Learn more about Progress: progress.com

Timestamps:
00:25 – The rise of agentic AI in marketing
01:15 – Navigating the hype vs. harm of AI agents
02:45 – Real-world example: AI-driven real estate personalization
03:50 – Volitional personalization vs. speculative personalization
05:30 – Why combining push and pull strategies matters
07:00 – Alarm clocks, AI, and the new search experience
08:10 – Juan’s hot take: The death of marketing visibility
10:20 – Where Juan goes to learn: Hacker News & hands-on experimentation