Chris Enss is a New York Times bestselling author, historian, and private investigator known for her extensive work chronicling the lives of women in the American West. With more than 20 books to her name, she specializes in uncovering the truth behind legends—whether about lawmen, gunslingers, or the women often written out of the narrative.

Learn more about Chris Enss at chrisenss.com or follow her on Instagram @chrisenssauthor.

Her latest book, Meet the Kellys: The True Story of Machine Gun Kelly and His Moll Kathryn Thorne, is available now at Amazon, Barnes & Noble, KensingtonBooks.com, and bookstores everywhere.

In this episode of Zone 7, Crime Scene Investigator Sheryl McCollum sits down with bestselling author and private investigator Chris Enss to dig into the real story of Kathryn Thorne—the woman who didn’t just stand beside Machine Gun Kelly but helped build his legend. They talk about Kathryn’s sharp mind, bold choices, and how she planned a headline-making kidnapping and even called J. Edgar Hoover herself. Sheryl and Chris also get into the early days of the FBI, where the term “G-Man” really came from, and how the courtroom became Kathryn’s stage.

Show Notes:

• (0:00) Welcome to Zone 7 with guest Chris Enss
• (1:30) The Kellys vs. Bonnie and Clyde
• (3:00) Ground-level research and historical truth
• (6:05) According to Kate and the untold story of Doc Holliday
• (10:50) Kathryn Thorne was all about what she wanted
• (14:30) Turning Machine Gun Kelly into a myth
• (16:45) Charm, privilege, and the making of an outlaw
• (22:00) The kidnapping of Charles Urschel
• (25:30) Lindbergh Law and the FBI’s rise to power
• (29:30) The double kidnapping and the G-Man legend
• (33:00) Kathryn Thorne plays the victim
• (36:00) Silk in the courtroom and a spotlight on the stand
• (38:30) Getting what she wanted, even as questions remain
• (40:30) “I wish he had left the dog” – Little Steve Stevens

Thanks for listening to another episode! If you're enjoying Zone 7, head over to Apple Podcasts and leave a quick rating and review—it’s one of the best ways to support the show and help others find it.

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Sheryl “Mac” McCollum is an Emmy Award winning CSI, a writer for CrimeOnLine, Forensic and Crime Scene Expert for Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, and a CSI for a metro Atlanta Police Department. She is the co-author of the textbook Cold Case: Pathways to Justice. Sheryl is also the founder and director of the Cold Case Investigative Research Institute, a collaboration between universities and colleges that brings researchers, practitioners, students and the criminal justice community together to advance techniques in solving cold cases and assist families and law enforcement with solvability factors for unsolved homicides, missing persons, and kidnapping cases.

Social Links:

• Email: coldcase2004@gmail.com

• Twitter: @ColdCaseTips

• Facebook: @sheryl.mccollum

Instagram: @officialzone7podcast

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

In this episode of Zone 7, Crime Scene Investigator, Sheryl McCollum, brings together a powerhouse panel including Susan Hendricks, Joshua Schiffer, Dani after Dark, and Kirk Nurmi to break down the second trial of Karen Read, and it’s more than just a courtroom drama. They unpack how the defense pivoted from conspiracy to collision, why the prosecution’s own reenactment may have backfired, and how key testimony created more questions than answers. The group doesn’t shy away from the messy truth, pointing to public mistrust, missing evidence, and a system that feels off balance. From social media outrage to jury psychology, they explore why this case has gripped the nation and how it might end.

Guest Bio and Links:

Susan Hendricks is an investigative journalist and host of Headline Crime. Known for her thoughtful and fearless reporting, she brings national attention to overlooked cases and failures in the justice system. Connect with Susan on Instagram @susan_hendricks, on X @susanhendricks, and on Headline Crime.

Joshua Schiffer is a nationally recognized criminal defense attorney and regular Court TV contributor, known for his sharp legal analysis and strategic insight into high-profile cases. Connect with Joshua on Instagram @lawyerschiff and on X @lawyerschiff.

Dani is a legal content creator and host of Dani After Dark, known for her insightful, accessible analysis of high-profile criminal trials and her growing presence in the true crime community. Connect with Dani on Instagram @dani_after_dark or follow her on YouTube at @DaniAfterDark.

Kirk Nurmi is a former criminal defense attorney, author, and speaker who now shares his expertise on justice, ethics, and personal transformation. Learn more about Kirk on Instagram @nurmiunchained_ and at kirknurmi.com.

Show Notes:

• (0:00) Welcome back to Zone 7 with crime scene investigator, Sheryl McCollum
• (0:30) Sheryl introduces the panel: Susan Hendricks, Joshua Schiffer, Dani after Dark, and Kirk Nurmi
• (1:00) First impressions on closing arguments
• (4:30) How attorney demeanor influences the jury’s mindset
• (6:30) The hoodie, X-rays, and the Commonwealth’s missteps
• (9:30) “I can’t unsee what I saw”
• (11:30) What it’s like at ground zero: the buffer zone and beyond
• (13:00) The power of a clean, simple defense when the state fumbles the case
• (18:00) From guilty at first glance to not so sure
• (20:00) Can you convict without blood, tissue, or a chain of custody?
• (24:00) When justice feels unfinished and no one gets the truth
• (30:00) Finding grace in a divided conversation
• (33:00) Verdict watch: the panel’s predictions
• (34:30) How many times can you try the same person and still call it justice?

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Sheryl “Mac” McCollum is an Emmy Award winning CSI, a writer for CrimeOnLine, Forensic and Crime Scene Expert for Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, and a CSI for a metro Atlanta Police Department. She is the co-author of the textbook., Cold Case: Pathways to Justice. Sheryl is also the founder and director of the Cold Case Investigative Research Institute, a collaboration between universities and colleges that brings researchers, practitioners, students and the criminal justice community together to advance techniques in solving cold cases and assist families and law enforcement with solvability factors for unsolved homicides, missing persons, and kidnapping cases.

Social Links:

• Email: coldcase2004@gmail.com
• Twitter: @ColdCaseTips
• Facebook: @sheryl.mccollum

Instagram: @officialzone7podcast

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Today Nancy Grace and Sheryl McCollum get personal, powerful, and just a little bit poetic. From a town mourning its unlikely mascot to Nancy’s candid reflections on personal tragedy, the conversation explores how loss, both individual and shared, shapes the pursuit of justice. They examine the impact of victim-centered storytelling, particularly in the upcoming One Night in Idaho docuseries, and how it reframes our understanding of crime and accountability. Plus, they break down the Dateline leak that’s stirring controversy ahead of the Bryan Kohberger trial. Who leaked it, and why does it matter? The answers may be more complicated than you think.

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Show Notes:

• (0:00) Welcome! Nancy and Sheryl introduce this week’s crime roundup
• (0:30) Morning mayhem and family updates
• (2:00) Flat Creek Floyd: Mourning a town mascot
• (4:30) Keith’s story and the ripple effect of grief
• (6:00) One Night in Idaho: Why victim voices matter
• (10:30) Centering the story on those who lived it
• (11:30) Trial logistics, disruptions, and the emotional cost for families
• (14:40) What Happened to Ellen?: An American Miscarriage of Justice
• (15:30) Dateline leak causes a stir | Who leaked it, and what’s at stake
• (20:30) Connecting the victims: Sorority photos and Google searches
• (24:00) Was Maddie the real target?
• (26:30) Jury bias, leaks, and legal fallout
• (27:00) Kanye, titanium teeth, and courtroom chaos
• (28:00) Farewell to Flat Creek Floyd

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Nancy Grace is an outspoken, tireless advocate for victims’ rights and one of television's most respected legal analysts. Nancy Grace had a perfect conviction record during her decade as a prosecutor. She is the founder and publisher of CrimeOnline.com, a crime- fighting digital platform that investigates breaking crime news, spreads awareness of missing people and shines a light on cold cases.

In addition, Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, a daily show hosted by Grace, airs on SIRIUS XM’s Triumph Channel 111 and is downloadable as a podcast on all audio platforms - https://www.crimeonline.com/

Connect with Nancy:

X: @nancygrace

Instagram: @thenancygrace

Facebook: @nancygrace

Sheryl “Mac” McCollum is an Emmy Award winning CSI, a writer for CrimeOnLine, Forensic and Crime Scene Expert for Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, and a CSI for a metro Atlanta Police Department. She is the co-author of the textbook., Cold Case: Pathways to Justice.

Connect with Sheryl:

Email: coldcase2004@gmail.com

X: @ColdCaseTips

Facebook: @sheryl.mccollum

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.