Episodes

  • EP27 - 03MAR25 - Michael Cho at FrodoBots, building at the intersection of Robotics, Crypto, and AI - as an outsider
    Mar 3 2025

    BitRobot is building the “Bittensor for robots”

    They just raised $8m from top investors and depin founders to do so

    Here’s everything you need to know:

    Previously Michael @micoolcho built FrodoBots which is a fleet of sidewalk robots that can be operated, using natural language instructions, from anywhere in the world

    You can buy one for $199

    As a serial entrepreneur based in Singapore, he learned lessons that he’s now applying to BitRobot:

    “No point building a great product if you cannot figure out distribution”
    “You really wanna get the TAM right”
    “Helps a lot to be on the edge”

    FrodoBots was a hobby project during covid as a way to work together with his brothers

    It’s a mix of DEPIN, AI, robotics, and crypto (with $SAM, the memecoin)

    https://www.frodobots.ai/
    https://x.com/frodobots

    In a few years, they have:

    -shipped several sidewalk robot models, an order of magnitude cheaper than existing options

    -released the largest opensource dataset of 2000+ hours of human robot telemetry data

    -collaborated with researchers from Deepmind, UC Berkeley, YGG, and more

    Michael was red-pilled in crypto by depin project Helium (decentralized wireless)

    This made him realize he could turn his passion for robotics + AI into something much bigger

    Thus was born BitRobot — a bittensor-like network for robotics subnets

    So what is BitRobot?

    -network of subnets (independent robotics startups, projects, and competitions)

    -North Star is to “solve embodied AI”

    -co-created with Jonathan Victor (@jnthnvctr) and Juan Benet (@juanbenet) from Protocol Labs (the creators of Filecoin and IPFS)

    Whitepaper coming soon: http://bitrobot.ai/

    Why now?

    Michael believes robotics is an even playing field — maybe Tesla has won for self driving cars — but even with Optimus, they have the same challenges as every other robotics company

    “So crypto isn’t behind” (key point)

    If BitRobot’s incentives are structured well, the network could have more resources and move even faster than web2 competitors

    “Each subnet is a competition with a defined objective”

    Examples could include sidewalk robots… robots for home chores… datasets including video data and synthetic data… AI models specialized for robots…

    “History is very path dependent”
    Michael would not have believed BitRobot could exist if it weren’t for Axie, Helium, and Bittensor

    Like Bittensor, each subnet owner defines the objective – and define tokenomics within its subnet for resources, marketing, and community

    If there’s 10 subnets, how will rewards be distributed?
    (1) A Senate with human robotics experts
    (2) An AI decision maker (named Gandalf) as a counterweight to human biases

    “Each subnet should move embodied AI research forward”

    As subnets create value, the datasets and model weights will be open source for non-commercial use

    The BitRobot Foundation will accrue commercializable IP and represent the ecosystem

    Finally, Michael believes the bottleneck is the “10 to 100K world-class robotics researchers”

    BitRobot wants to find those robotics experts and help them with resources and money – let them 10x

    Thanks for reading all this!

    For more —
    Whitepaper coming soon on BitRobot.ai

    Follow @BitRobotNetwork

    Follow Michael @micoolcho

    In a followup thread, I’ll talk about Robots.fun — a new initiative from FrodoBots that is “Virtuals for robots” — stay tuned!


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    1 hr and 2 mins
  • EP26 - 21MAR24 - Michael Tiew at LongHash Ventures on the importance of developer ecosystems, how to build, influencers, price leading fundamentals, is ETH a security??
    Apr 12 2024

    Longhash
    Started 2018, one of first web3 accelerators - more Asia focused; Early stage founders
    What’s unique - close partnership w/ ecosystems - Polkadot, Filecoin, Acela
    Two funds - 2021 defi fund, 2022 infra/multichain fund
    Small distributed team

    Accelerator
    -running since 2018, how has your approach to startups changed since then
    -during bear cycles (2022-2023), hard to find capital - accelerator can really help during this phase
    -normally it’s a team of 2 cofounders, we’re 3rd cofounder - first check
    $100-200K co-invest
    -2024 meta - more money and investment options, accelerator is still core element of helping early stage

    What accelerator teams had most success and what was different about them?
    -if VC is 99% failure, accelerator is even greater risk
    -lot of teams just have idea
    -bet on background, seasoned founders
    -web3 / crypto native, what’s magic of web3
    -“great founders pivot with the times”

    Ecosystem report
    https://www.longhash.vc/post/bootstrapping-developer-ecosystems-for-web3-protocols
    -developers are always your first users - b2b2c
    -0:1 phase (bootstrap) and 1:100 phase (flywheel)
    -0:1 — need technology, need to market it well, core team must be very vocal + present
    what is your positioning? Solana = onchain Nasdaq; Bitcoin = digital gold
    Bittensor = incentivization platform for AI models
    write a lot, be vocal on twitter and farcaster, produce a lot of content
    meme season — attention is next currency
    -1:100 phase — now u have developers, how do u get them to build interesting stuff
    Ronin: focus on helping game devs build good games — dev tools, SDKs, marketplace
    address different dev needs (eg, new devs v experienced ones)

    How do builders choose between the ecosystems?
    Many are mercenary
    How do ecosystems retain devs?
    - Case studies on Axelar, Berachain, Solana
    - Devs wanna go where the users are — eg, narrative that users are migrating to Base

    Flywheel
    Get best devs to build a few pioneer apps / use cases — get good users — get more devs
    Ronin — onboarded Pixels team one year ago, migrated from Polygon, Mavis Hub + Ronin name service, went from 10K to several hundred K DAU

    Token price matters a lot in web3
    -in bull, everyone wants to stay in ecosystem, get rewards
    -in bear / when price crashes, how to retain? Need clear focus on what ecosystem is about, why devs should build there
    -for bootstrapping, need well-designed tokenomics so early adopters are rewarded, yet sustainable (deflationary) in long-run

    In-person / offline events — hosting events, panels, sponsoring conference tracks

    “Everyone building an ecosystem”
    L1s > L2s > L3s
    L1s > EigenDA / Celestia
    Big projects will become own appchains / rollups
    Want to become a place where new ideas are built atop

    Influencers / crypto Twitter
    “Attention is next big world currency”
    Everyone attention span getting shorter, TikTok
    Crypto next meme coin, next narrative
    Few types — investor type (actually invest), founder/builder type (know tech), token price type (appeal to retail, what’s next 10x)

    Links shared:
    https://x.com/mo_baioumy/status/1760296558539501698
    @mo_baioumy AI x Crypto is a hot narrative right now.

    https://www.workingtheorys.com/p/before-the-crowd

    This is the same way people talk about the good ole days of the San Francisco tech scene (circa late 2000s to mid 2010s). The meetups were more meetup-y. The hackathons were more hack-y. The nerds were more nerdy. Everything in the tech scene felt more authentic, more egalitarian, and less sceney


    follow Michael on X @brazenburrit0

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    43 mins
  • EP25 - 19FEB24 - FlexStack (fka ParrotAI) founder Andy Tran discusses a future decentralized AI
    Mar 19 2024

    Follow Two Degens on X - @habits and @bridgexplore

    Subscribe and listen to past episodes: twodegens.com

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    53 mins
  • EP24 - 7MAR24 - CodeXchain founders Ika and Andrea discuss The Fastest Way To Build DApps Without Code
    Mar 19 2024

    Building tech is expensive and time-consuming. CodeX is an all-in-one no-code AI-powered ecosystem for WEB3 mass adoption. Build faster and cheaper. Learn more here https://codexchain.xyz/home
    and follow

    Follow Two Degens on X - @habits and @bridgexplore

    Subscribe and listen to past episodes: twodegens.com


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    39 mins
  • EP23 - 6FEB24 - crypto market update, intersection of AI/ Crypto, information hazards, and other musings
    Feb 7 2024

    Follow Two Degens on X: @habits and @bridgexplore

    Subscribe and listen to past episodes: twodegens.com

    Kevin’s links

    https://kevinhabits.com/media/kevin-kelly-saw-the-future-in-1997-in-the-network-economy-follow-the-free
    Kevin Kelly - 1997 - New Rules for the New Economy


    https://kevinhabits.com/cryptoes/collection-of-recent-crypto-learnings-crypto-is-the-machines-body-and-ai-is-the-brain-that-enters-into-it
    Redphonecrypto’s 69 theses


    https://kevinhabits.com/media/an-exhaustive-and-beautiful-reminder-of-how-good-we-got-it-from-gwern
    Gwern’s list of things that have gotten better since the 90s


    https://kevinhabits.com/media/the-important-concept-of-social-information-hazards-it-is-more-like-a-black-pill-that-might-give-you-a-slightly-more-accurate-understanding-of-how-the-world-works-but-saps-your-motivation-to-effect
    Jeff Lonsdale on information hazards



    Jorge’s links

    Mental model:
    Blockchain is like CO2 / Electricity, and AI like plants/machines that thrive on it?


    https://twitter.com/nillionnetwork/status/1752433717446901887?s=46
    Would you openly give an AI assistant 10+ years of your text conversations (and everything else) knowing OpenAI had full control over it?

    https://twitter.com/VitalikButerin/status/1752291413503729751
    Vitalik – The promise and challenges of crypto + AI applications

    https://twitter.com/qwqiao/status/1752820832160596015?s=46
    Bittensor is a cult. Everyone I know who has spent more than 5min researching it is bullish, but no one can explain to me why. Never fade cults in crypto.

    https://www.caseycaruso.com/thoughts/decentralized-ai
    Potential market opportunities in the intersection of AI and Crypto


    https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/college-admissions-educational-consultants-command-education.html

    Consulting services for those applying for university -- $250,000 for a two-week intensive period that helps refine students' regular-decision applications before early January deadlines -- highlights the complex dynamics and pressures within the college admissions landscape.

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    35 mins
  • EP22 - 14JUN23 - Izumi founder @jimmyyin building the cross chain AMM and liquidity, and top DEX on ZKSync Era
    Jun 20 2023

    Show notes:
    Jimmy @jimmyyin talks about how he started learning about crypto in 2016 while at UC Berkeley, founded Tsinghua Student Blockchain Association in 2017, and how his current project @izumi_Finance

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    48 mins
  • EP21 - 12JUN23 - SEC unleashes assault on Coinbase and BInance and the implications, Sequoia split into 3, Americans in 1700s vs today, monetary premium in crypto networks
    Jun 17 2023

    Media to discuss


    • https://www.forbes.com/sites/jonathanponciano/2022/02/17/sequoia-launches-500-million-fund-to-invest-in-crypto-tokens-as-silicon-valley-throws-billions-at-blockchain/?sh=41a037e12510
      • Sequoia launching a fund to buy crypto tokens - while also splitting into separate global entities
    • https://medium.com/vision-hill-blog/understanding-monetary-premiums-in-programmable-value-networks-74f0ba2b91c2
      • If GDP = value of corporate productivity, programmable money = value of developer activity
      • Thus, a network’s ability to earn a monetary premium, depends, to an arguably large degree, on the strength of its developer base. If developers abandon one network in order to build on another, whether due to improved UI/UX, computational efficiencies or simply a better perceived community and sense of belonging, the original network’s monetary premium should not be expected to hold its value over time if that developer base is not adequately replenished with equal or greater caliber
    • Classic: https://waitbutwhy.com/2015/12/the-tail-end.html
      • The ocean is freezing and putting my body into it is a bad life experience, so I tend to limit myself to around one ocean swim a year. So as weird as it seems, I might only go in the ocean 60 more times
      • I probably eat pizza about once a month, so I’ve got about 700 more chances to eat pizza
      • http://www.paulgraham.com/vb.html


    • In regards to Gary Gensler SEC law: https://twitter.com/LibertyCappy/status/1666437353794322432?s=20


    • https://twitter.com/IAmMarkManson/status/1584163981828112385?s=20
      • A good life is largely defined by what's missing: - The fights that don't happen - The health problems you don't have - The debt you avoid - The desires you don't indulge A good life's not about gaining. It's about letting go.
    • Carl sagan: demon haunted world: https://twitter.com/highbrow_nobrow/status/1665815355657207809?s=20
      • The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark, In 1995, American astronomer Carl Sagan predicted what a future American society could look like. His forecast has been proven prescient. Read the image.




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    36 mins
  • 5 Minute Crypto ⏳ - why ETH = $7200; Axie leads web3 games; why BTC bull market is back; 8 next narratives, and moar
    Jun 5 2023

    Howdy everyone — this is the 5 minute crypto update for Monday, June 5, hope everyone had a lovely weekend

    Today we’ve got a ton to cover, I’ll go over it faster than usual, globalization, web3 gaming, ETH metrics, bitcoin halving, Bali, and more

    Let’s do this like Buddhists



    Food for thought
    https://conversableeconomist.com/2023/05/26/globalization-evolves-not-reverses/
    -exports as a share of GDP have levelled off in recent years–while remaining near the all-time high. However, global flows of data and information are dramatically rising
    -Roughly 20% of global economic output is exported (in value-added terms), FDI flows equal just 6% of gross fixed capital formation, about 7% of phone call minutes (including calls over the internet) are international, and only 4% of people live outside of the countries where they were born

    Interesting stats on ETH network gas usage
    Top was DEX trading at 26% of gas
    Next at 12% was a tie between NFT mints and token transfers

    https://twitter.com/AdrianoFeria/status/1663571657594683392
    Nvidia has a P/E of 214
    If ETH had the same P/E, its price would be $7200

    https://twitter.com/iamzeroika/status/1664294156385280000?s=46
    A few narratives that stood out to me
    -Tokenized real world assets
    -GambleFi
    -Memecoins, to quote: “Funny logo ➩ low value ➩ get rich overnight ➩gamble.”

    https://twitter.com/DappRadar/status/1663265129776005120
    A lot of people counting Axie Infinity out, but according to DappRadar, it’s still the top blockchain game by 7d volume at $9.4M

    https://www.onceinaspecies.com/p/655-bitcoin-indicators-suggest-bull
    Another great piece from Jesse Myers Croesus BTC on why he believes we’ve entered the early phases of a Bitcoin bull market - and other analysts I respect largely agree such as Bob Loukas
    “History doesn’t repeat itself, but it often rhymes. And it rhymes because humans behave in similar ways when exposed to the same set of conditions.”

    https://blockworks.co/news/bali-pay-crypto-prohibited
    According to Blockworks, Bali is apparently warning tourists against using crypto for any forms of payment
    While licensed entities in Indonesia are allowed to trade crypto assets, crypto as a form of payment is still illegal

    https://cryptohayes.substack.com/p/patience-is-beautiful
    the net effect of US monetary policy is currently stimulative and the money printer is churning out more and more fiat toilet paper. And remember, this happens /because/ the Fed is raising rates to fight inflation. But if raising interest rates is actually increasing the money supply, then it follows that *raising interest rates actually increases inflation*.
    he also predicts 3 things will happen

    https://newsletter.mollywhite.net/p/andreessen-horowitzs-state-of-crypto
    Always good to read your critics and she’s both funny and fair

    https://twitter.com/definapkin/status/1656135765942841345?s=46
    -there have been 3 halving - 2012, 16, and 2020
    -expected next one is March 2024, reward drops from 6.25 to 3.125btc
    -2012 - lasted 13 months, 90x increase, 2016 - 18 months, 29x increase, 2020 - 19 months, 12x increase



    That’s it for today! All the links are in the show notes. You can follow @twodegenspod on Twitter and subscribe for more!

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    9 mins
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