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In the National Interest

In the National Interest

By: Center for the National Interest
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"In the National Interest" is a podcast that explores the intersection of foreign and defense policy, national security, and U.S. politics. It is not about world affairs, but about American interests and the realist approach needed to promote them. What actually constitutes true realism is, of course, a source of controversy. And so, the series promotes fresh debate by featuring a variety of leading experts from government, industry, journalism, and academia, many of whom may at times disagree with each other. Each episode is hosted by Jacob Heilbrunn, editor of The National Interest magazine, and published by the Center for the National Interest.

Center for the National Interest, 2024
Political Science Politics & Government
Episodes
  • The Sorcerer's Apprentice? American Politics from Buckley to Trump (w/ Sam Tanenhaus)
    Jun 26 2025

    What does the life of William F. Buckley, Jr. reveal about the deeper currents shaping American politics? In this episode, Jacob Heilbrunn speaks with Sam Tanenhaus, a former editor of The New York Times Book Review and the author of the new biography “Buckley: The Life and the Revolution That Changed America” (Random House, 2025). Together, they examine how outsider campaigns, cultural backlash, and the performance of political authenticity have reshaped both the right and the left. Is Trump the culmination, or corruption, of Buckley's movement? Has the liberal establishment lost its hold not just on power, but on the language of ideas itself? And in a time of ideological confusion and institutional decay, is today's chaos a break from the past or its inevitable result?

    Music by Aleksey Chistilin from Pixabay

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    1 hr and 12 mins
  • Diplomacy in the Crosshairs (w/ Paul Saunders)
    Apr 24 2025

    Secretary of State Marco Rubio has released the Trump administration's plans for reorganizing the State Department—a first step toward reducing what the White House calls a bloated and inefficient bureaucracy. The proposed reforms could reshape U.S. engagement with the world, ending America’s human rights advocacy, shuttering key diplomatic offices, and threatening the very infrastructure that supports global U.S. leadership. With Congress holding the purse strings and foreign governments watching closely, how far will these reforms go—and at what cost to American influence and values abroad?

    In this episode, Jacob Heilbrunn speaks with Paul Saunders, the president of the Center for the National Interest. Saunders served in the George W. Bush Administration from 2003 to 2005 as Senior Advisor to the Under Secretary of State for Global Affairs.

    Music by Aleksey Chistilin from Pixabay

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    26 mins
  • Trump's Tariffs and Energy Market Turmoil (w/ Tatiana Mitrova)
    Apr 7 2025

    President Donald Trump’s announcement of sweeping new global tariffs last week sent shockwaves through international markets, igniting fears of economic slowdown and triggering retaliatory measures from major trading partners like China. The consequences are already reverberating through the global energy system: oil and gas prices are sliding, producers are under pressure, and the clean energy transition faces fresh headwinds as tariffs hit solar panels, EVs, and battery components. With geopolitical tensions simmering and economic uncertainty rising, could Trump’s tariff gamble reshape the global energy landscape for years to come? And how vulnerable is Russia’s oil-dependent economy in this new low-price era?

    In this episode, Paul Saunders speaks with Tatiana Mitrova, a Research Fellow at Columbia University’s Center on Global Energy Policy and Director of the New Energy Advancement Hub. Mitrova has twenty-five years of experience in dealing with global energy markets, including production, transportation, demand, energy policy, pricing, and market restructuring.

    Music by Aleksey Chistilin from Pixabay

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    17 mins
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